I was vaguely aware of the English Civil War as a kid, mainly due to seeing The Sealed Knot at various military shows, but it never featured as part of my formative wargaming years. It wasn't until I went to Uni that I started to play the ECW, courtesy of a fellow friend and student who was madly keen on the period. Having little money we managed to share the cost of a Strategy & Tactics magazine that had rules, counters and a map of Marston Moor. Ever since then I've had an abiding interest in the pike & shotte era, but mainly the ECW, collecting rules and reference material, which can be seen below:
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My Uni friend lent me this way back when to give me a good guide to the period. I had never owned a copy but must have seen it as a kid as I remember the illustrations at the start of each chapter. I now have my own copy and enjoy re-reading it for that blast of nostalgia.
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Various Warlord Games rules that like so many of their products, people either love or hate. The one big advantage of them is that the C&C system is similar across their rules, making it relatively easy to move from one to another, which is a big bonus in my book.
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Two excellent rulesets, but I have only ever played a few games of FK&P and none of Baroque, to my eternal shame.
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An excellent book by Wesencraft, bought purely to add to my library of old school books. However it is an excellent read, with some interesting rules and a great selection of historical scenarios at the end, which I have yet to play.
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Bob Cordery's latest offering bought as a Xmas treat this year. I've given the rules a quick run out, but there are several in there as well as some siege rules.
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As a playtester of 'The Pikemen's Lament, I have a fair few games under my belt and even have some partially finished forces for both sides. I think the rules work better when playing FtF games rather than solo, due to the 'roleplay' nature of the leaders. Irregular Wars bought as a birthday treat but look to be a very good set of rules.
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The Osprey books bought mainly becuase I love Angus McBride as an illustrator! Very useful reference material though as one would expect.
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I'm not sure why I bought this, but I'm glad I did as i think it is better than the Opsrey books above and a damned site cheaper too!
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A mix of WI magazines that have some great articles by Barry Hilton on 'The Glorious Revolution'.
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With my interest piqued by the above, this was bought as a reference book to a period I know very little about and it is superb. Although not in colour, it is still worth getting and cheaper than the current offerings covering the same period.
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The Monmouth Rebellion is fairly new to me, but as I live very close to Keynsham, the closest point Monmouth got to Bristol, it is of great interest and full of potential wargaming 'what if's?'. The other book on Killiecrankie was bought as part of an aim to possibly game the various Jacobite Risings, which I'm learning a lot about and all new but interesting to me nonetheless.
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So with a wealth of material and rules to hand, why have I not actually gamed the P&S era, despite having the figures (in bags of course!) or wooden blocks to play with? I'm not sure to be honest. None of the rules above really grabbed me, but to be fair I haven't given them a fair chance, as due to me typical butterfly nature, I have moved onto other projects.
In fact I was even thinking of selling on my figures and most of the books when I saw AARs on Keith's Blog and Mark's Blog and thought I really should give the P&S period a second chance. Rather than the ECW though I want to focus on 'The Glorious Revolution' period as it just interests me more now and is more colourful IMHO, as can be seen on the aforementioned Blogs.
Moving forward the aim is to play some small engagements, using my wooden blocks, with some of the rules above, to see which, if any, really grab me. I did consider buying the latest rules as used by Keith and Mark, but cannot justify the cost at present, which is probably a wise move! So now it is a case of some serious reading and I will start with Warlord Games P&S rules, but using the ECW tweaks, as they should, famous last words, be easy to get to grips with. Hopefully soon I'll be able to post some AARs and thoughts on the rules.
Watching with interest and think the P&S is a good starting point. From memory, the P&S would treat a pike and two musket sleeves as 3 units, to the point that each could go off on their own jolly. Somewhere (it may be the ECW supplement) a rule was brought in to tie them together.
ReplyDeleteI'm currently readin P&S and it's all fairly similar to BP, which is good. the original rules where a sleeve of muskets could rout and the rest of the unit carry on, seemed wrong to me. In the ECW supplement they changed it to the option of treating the trhee units as one, which made much more sense and what most players had already adopted as a house rule.
DeleteSteve, you have a good selection of P&S books. Wesencraft is one of my favorites as id Grant. I enjoy Baroque as a game but have yet to FK&P for the grid.
ReplyDeleteI think it a shame to sell off your figures and books. You never know when an interest in ECW might rekindle.
The Wesencraft book is a pleasure too read and as discussed before, probably my favourite 'old school' author. After seeing the 'Beneath the Lily Banners' games, I'm definitely keeping my LoA figures and will base them up when I've decided on a rulleset I like and a base size that works with them. The Osprey books will go as the Haythornthwaite one is much better, but I will probably keep the rest as you never know what the future might hold in terms of rekindled ECW interest!
DeleteA very timely post Steve, as we played a P&S game yesterday at Julians, using For King and Parliament - I will blog about it later today. I am about to get a load of Ebor GNW Swedes but I have warned Nick (Our Lilly Banners protagonist) that I would really like to get some Front Rank figures for Monmouth/William III periods - Killiekrankie, the Boyne etc a la Barry Hilton. By the way, I also have that Haythornthwaite book and totally agree its way better than a single Osprey or even all of them - much more detail in the former. Good luck with getting your LoA figures painted and on the table, sorry, but blocks of wood dont really have the same aesthetic appeal!
ReplyDeleteLooking forward to your post Keith on how the game went etc. The Monmouth period and just after attracts me more at present, from a visual point of view and a greater choice to troops from varied nations etc. The Haythornthwaite books is a gem as you rightly say. The wooden blocks allow me to quicky try out rules etc as my painting speed is notoriously slow and I hate using bare metal miniatures!
DeleteA period I have always hankered after gaming since reading an article in Battle magazine probably back in 1975. But too many projects at the moment so it will wait till I retire👍
ReplyDeleteMy interest in 'The Glorious Revolution' and 'Monmouth's Rebellion' came about via Barry Hilton's articles in the magazine shown above. Without those I doubt I would have even thought about gaming these periods. Too many projects is the curse of the wargamer Matt, but I'm looking for something 'new' this year to get my teeth into, but how well I get on remains to be seen!
DeleteI have always had a bit of an interest since watching the 1972 HTV series Pretenders as a kid - this is a review from the web:
DeleteI loved this series when it came out in the 70's. A rare telling of the Monmouth rebellion. Moves at a fast pace & fine location filming in the West country & Wales gives it a wonderful period feel. Fine acting all round & it makes me wonder why Curtis Arden didn't go on & make a career as an actor. He is very natural here!
I don't remember the series Keith but will check it out and see if it's on Youtube to watch:)
DeleteIt took me 40 years to get around to pike and shotte wargaming (ECW specifically) but I’m very glad I did. My P&S library is a good challenger for my 18th century library now. There are many reasons to be hooked on the ECW. I still have a hankering after the Monmouth Rebellion though.
ReplyDeleteI love the Wesencraft book. Absolutely love it! The Haythornthwaite is a goody too. Don’t have the others though.
I still like the ECW but the Monmouth Rebellion onwards is attracting me at present. Wesencraft is a great author and I'm looking forward to re-reading his book as part of my 'project'. Haythornthwaite are real goody as you say.
DeleteThe Days of King Monmouth by Ralph Mitchard (of the Wars of Louis Quatorze blog) is a must have IMO. If you haven't read it, it's a day-by-day account.
DeleteThanks for the 'heads up' as I haven't read this:)
DeleteYou certainly have a nice collection of books and rules. It is really interesting how having, or finding, as set of rules which are both enjoyable to play and capture the flavour of the period are important to tie together the wargaming experience.
ReplyDeleteThanks Peter. I agree that you need to find a set of rules that work for you and provide an enjoyable game. Over the years I've played some good rules with clever mechanics, which haven't provided that all important 'fun' game. This is why I'm trying to stick with rules I know and enjoy, rather than searching for that 'Holy Grail' ruleset!
DeleteECW was my second period, started in the mid 1970's, and my least utilized armies ever after, due to a lackod rules that Iliked. Well, I like For King and Parliament a lot, andIwas pleased with how well Filed of Battle, 3rd edition, with ECW mods worked.
ReplyDeleteYour mileage may vary, though, as it is said! :-)
Unless you can find rules you like for a period, then it is hard to game it. FK&P are great rules but as said, I'm trying to minimise the different sets I play so I can remember the rules more easily and therefore concentrate on the games.
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